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07-30-2018, 12:53 PM
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#21
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 281
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You need to check the voltage at the starter, it needs to 10.5 volt minimum, as the voltage goes down the amps go up, amps = heat
Uh, that's cranking voltage, the place you borrowed the meter from may have one, and a lot of times ones built into a load tester
__________________
Mike & Becky
2005 Crescendo 8356
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07-31-2018, 06:17 AM
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#22
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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Bad starter.
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08-02-2018, 07:59 AM
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#23
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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Hi
Thanks everyone for your responses.
Update.
The voltage at the starter motor is 11.2v.
I spoke with freightliner who advised that Nippon Denso starter motors were in fact used on many of their models and that the one I removed was probably the original unit. I replaced the old one with the exact same model. I have now removed the new starter and taken it to an auto electrician. It tested perfectly. So I am left with something else perhaps a seized accessory like an alternator. If so I would need to release the accessory belt/s to test. Again a problem in terms of access.
Any thoughts would be great!
Cheers
Dave
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08-02-2018, 08:36 AM
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#24
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave J
Hi
Thanks everyone for your responses.
Update.
The voltage at the starter motor is 11.2v.
I spoke with freightliner who advised that Nippon Denso starter motors were in fact used on many of their models and that the one I removed was probably the original unit. I replaced the old one with the exact same model. I have now removed the new starter and taken it to an auto electrician. It tested perfectly. So I am left with something else perhaps a seized accessory like an alternator. If so I would need to release the accessory belt/s to test. Again a problem in terms of access.
Any thoughts would be great!
Cheers
Dave
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There's the problem. 11.2 at starter will definitely cause slow cranking.
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08-02-2018, 08:56 AM
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#25
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Mechanicsville, Md.
Posts: 487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave J
Hi
Thanks everyone for your responses.
Update.
The voltage at the starter motor is 11.2v.
I spoke with freightliner
Any thoughts would be great!
Cheers
Dave
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Even with the coach plugged in or with the generator online (converter running) you still only see 11.2 Vdc at the starter? If so you're dropping a lot of voltage from the battery to the starter. I don't know sh@# about diesels but that doesn't sound right. Check the terminal ends for corrosion. There is some significant resistance to drop that much.
Sudsy
__________________
2005 Sun Voyager Workhorse W24 with 8.1 ltr Chevy. Allison 2100 transmission. Full body paint.
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08-02-2018, 09:03 AM
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#26
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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I've seen a bad glow plug make the voltage drop that much at the starter.... and it cranked slowly.
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08-02-2018, 09:34 AM
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#27
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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Hi,
Thanks. I am going to get a new multimeter. Mine is 11 years old and may well not be very accurate.
Cheers
Dave
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08-02-2018, 12:07 PM
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#28
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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OK new multimeter and voltage at starter shows as 12.3-12.4.
So something else perhaps a seized accessory, but how to even get to the belts to remove accessory belt/s for testing! The access point under the bed is minute and it seems like one has to get there through the removal of radiator, shrouds hydraulic reservoir etc first. Anyone know the best way on Gulfstream 2003 friendship?
Thanks,
Dave
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08-02-2018, 01:09 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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I would check it with the key on and see if it stays the same.
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08-02-2018, 08:50 PM
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#30
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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Hi.
Key was on.
Cheers
Dave
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08-03-2018, 06:00 AM
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#31
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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So after you bought it, and had it delivered, you never started it once, never heard it start?
No telling where the friction is then. I think I would hook up my jumper box and maybe it would crank fast enough to start.
From a mechanic's point of view I've only seen this with corrosion on the cylinder walls or a spun main bearing. Never an accessories causing slow cranking.
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08-03-2018, 08:12 AM
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#32
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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Hi Restorium,
It may help if I detail the full history.
I bought the unit used about 3.5 years ago. I hired a driver to drive it about 3,000 kms to where I live. He reported that it worked perfectly. After that my wife and I had a few short trips to local campgrounds with grandkids.
The problem started the beginning of the winter before last. We had just returned from a short trip to a local (25k distance) campground. I parked the unit in my driveway (where it has remained ever since), extended the leveling jacks and winterised it. I plugged into shore power and turned the battery switches off (Coach battery inside the unit and starting batteries in their compartment). It sat for about 5.5 months before I came to start it. I do not recall the temperature when I came to start it at the end of winter, but I do recall NOT plugging in the block heater. The cranking started off and actually seemed normal maybe a little slow at first but nothing like now. After about 10-15 seconds it seemed as if the batteries were running down and shortly after it would not crank. I placed the batteries on a 40 amp charge rate and left them to charge for about 1.5 hours. When I came to try and start it the ignition key did nothing. Using my multimeter I determined that the battery on/off switch in the compartment had ceased to function and remained permanently in the off position. I removed the switch out of the circuit simply by bypassing it. From that moment on I have had this slow crank.
I have cleaned all leads put 2 new earths from starter to chassis and to block. It has a new starter and a new solenoid.
Any thoughts??
Cheers
Dave
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08-03-2018, 08:17 AM
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#33
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Mechanicsville, Md.
Posts: 487
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Location of components
How long of a run is it from the batteries to the starter?
Sudsy
__________________
2005 Sun Voyager Workhorse W24 with 8.1 ltr Chevy. Allison 2100 transmission. Full body paint.
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08-03-2018, 08:22 AM
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#34
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New Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Grassie
Posts: 26
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Hi Sudsy,
Its about 6-7 foot following the path of the #1 cable.
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08-03-2018, 08:30 AM
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#35
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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I would keep testing.
The next thing I would do is run a jumper cable from the starter to the ground side of the battery and try that. This will eliminate any chance of it being a bad ground.
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08-03-2018, 08:39 AM
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#36
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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IF it was being caused by an accessory it would probably be the AC compressor. There should be some evidence of shredded belt material near the pulley. See if you can get a mirror and light in there and see what the belt looks like. If the pulley is seized there will be some damage to the belt being dragged over a stopped pulley.
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08-03-2018, 08:58 AM
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#37
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Mechanicsville, Md.
Posts: 487
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Positive side
Would it be possible to run a parallel cable using the jumper cables from the battery positive to the positive connection on the starter. Not the solenoid. This would show if the positive cable is dropping too much voltage.
Sudsy
__________________
2005 Sun Voyager Workhorse W24 with 8.1 ltr Chevy. Allison 2100 transmission. Full body paint.
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08-03-2018, 09:31 AM
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#38
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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You have to work with the story.
What could have happened over 5 months of sitting in the winter?
Battery is the most suspect. Then the starter.
After that, some sort of corrosion somewhere.
Then, coolant froze because of water in it. Cracked the block or pushed out a head gasket.
Least likely would be a seized front accessory, especially when there wasn't any evidence of malfunction before it being parked.
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08-03-2018, 10:01 AM
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#39
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Mechanicsville, Md.
Posts: 487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Restorium
You have to work with the story.
What could have happened over 5 months of sitting in the winter?
Battery is the most suspect. Then the starter.
After that, some sort of corrosion somewhere.
Then, coolant froze because of water in it. Cracked the block or pushed out a head gasket.
Least likely would be a seized front accessory, especially when there wasn't any evidence of malfunction before it being parked.
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I thought they were new batteries and the started is also new and just bench checked this week.
Sudsy
__________________
2005 Sun Voyager Workhorse W24 with 8.1 ltr Chevy. Allison 2100 transmission. Full body paint.
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08-03-2018, 10:42 AM
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#40
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sudsy
I thought they were new batteries and the started is also new and just bench checked this week.
Sudsy
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Exactly.
That leaves a fairly short list of possibilities. Not looking good at this point.
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