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Old 08-17-2022, 04:42 PM   #21
bhplumber
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Have you tried the power hungry reflash in your 365? If I could safely tune my 365 to around 350 Hp and gain some Trq I would much rather not do a engine swap. Mine is deleted but I have not done head studs, I guess I haven't convinced myself to spend the money on them as a precaution or just wait until the issue arises if it ever does.. I do believe there would be advantages to a Cummins swap but do they outweigh the expense?
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Old 08-19-2022, 08:46 PM   #22
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The Cummins Supernova drove out of the shop today under its own power. I took a few laps around my driveway and mother fell off or blew-up. Thanks not two issues I have are:

My stupid Wabco brakes are throwing a code

For some reason my power steering is not working.

Still have fun and getting closer to my first road text.
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Old 08-19-2022, 09:53 PM   #23
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That’s awesome! Congrats Tim! I pick up my rig in 5 days in California and have to drive it back to Michigan �� we do have a local 6.0 diesel guy we call 6-0 Joe… he charges about $5k for full bulletproof with ARP head studs, then ordering the Orion programmer, called and talked to them and hypermax and did confirm that the hypermax is just FICM tunes so I will be going with the Orion once the engine is ready… probably won’t have it bulletproffed until next year! Plan on using it that way for a few years as I accumulate parts and pieces for swap like Tim did! Can’t wait to hear all the kinks are worked out!!
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Old 08-21-2022, 09:06 AM   #24
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Picked up my 8.9 ISL today, found one paired with a B400r trans still not planning to do it right away but I will be slowly getting it ready 👍
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Old 09-24-2022, 07:10 PM   #25
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I took the ISL / 6400 out on the road for the first time today. Unfortunately I did not make it very far. Actually on the first attempt I did not even make it out of the driveway. I had two big charge air leaks and every time I stepped on the throttle it made a heck of a load whistling noise. Back to the shop and a couple new hose clamps installed and I was ready to try it again. The second time I made it onto the road and about 2 or 3 miles from my house and the engine started to overheat and the transmission threw a code. I pulled over and let the engine cool down and was able to drive it back home.

Once I got it back to the shop and inspected everything, it appears the engine had an air pocket around the thermostat. I think the air has left the system now because it’s a gallon low on coolant and prior to taking it on the road it was filled to the full mark (it did not blow it out the vent tube).

The transmission code was a pressure out of range. I know the transmission was a little low on oil so I am going to top off the oil clear the code and try it again.

Fun times.
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Old 09-24-2022, 07:27 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTMICH5 View Post
Picked up my 8.9 ISL today, found one paired with a B400r trans still not planning to do it right away but I will be slowly getting it ready 👍
What year is the engine? Is it a common rail or is it a CAPS engine? If it is a CAPS engine you may want to consider holding off for a common rail engine.

That looks like a GEN 3 transmission but I could be wrong. If it is a Gen 3 the good news is that it will work. The bad news is that it will be more difficult to make it work. Also Gen 3 TCM’s are getting hard to find and they can be expensive when you do find them.

Gen 3 Allison transmissions require three transmission control modules (TCM’s). The Gen 4 and 5 Allison transmissions use a single TCM. The Allison 2500’s in our RV’s are Gen 4 so you can use the stock connectors and much of the stock wiring. My ISL came with a Gen 3 and I ended up purchasing a Gen 4 because it was going to be way easier to do the install.
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Old 09-25-2022, 07:46 AM   #27
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The engine is a caps, in my research people were saying to stay away from the first few years of common rails as they were problematic over the caps style, is that not true? Will I have problems meshing the computer into the system? The engine is a 2008, I figured same year as the coach would be most similar to mesh in as communications should be similar (same year as if it was originally put in). How do i tell which trans I have? The transmission was rebuilt by ww Williams and they removed the original data plate and put on their own, I don’t see a lookup on their website like Allison has… might take some digging…. 👎
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Old 09-25-2022, 10:36 AM   #28
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The engine is a caps, in my research people were saying to stay away from the first few years of common rails as they were problematic over the caps style, is that not true? Will I have problems meshing the computer into the system? The engine is a 2008, I figured same year as the coach would be most similar to mesh in as communications should be similar (same year as if it was originally put in). How do i tell which trans I have? The transmission was rebuilt by ww Williams and they removed the original data plate and put on their own, I don’t see a lookup on their website like Allison has… might take some digging…. 👎
If it’s a 2008 I would assume it’s an 8.3L ISC, not an ISL. I think 2003 was the last year for a CAPS ISL. 2004 and up ISL’s are all common rail.

There is a group of ISL engine serial numbers in the 2004/2005 time range that had issues with the connecting rods (I think it was the connecting rods). It is well documented and you can Google it to find out what serial numbers were affected. It was a manufacturer defect, not a design issue. Other than this issue the common rail ISL’s have been very dependable.

Meshing the engine ECM to International electronics should work just fine. You will need to find out what ECM the engine is running. It will be something like CM850 or CM2150. You will need to know this to figure out the wire connections.

If the transmission serial number tag has been removed it will be hard to get any information from Allison. The reason I think it’s a Gen 3 transmission is because of the round wire connector you can see in the photo. Gen 4/5 transmissions used a square or rectangular connector. Also the GEN 4/5 connectors are directly mounted to the transmission; not on a pigtail like the one in the photo.

In summary if it is an ISC that’s ok because the ISC was a good engine and could be configured up to approx. 365 HP and approx. 1100 torque. However I would look at swapping the Gen 3 transmission for a Gen 4 as this will make things much easier for you.
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Old 09-25-2022, 10:46 AM   #29
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As an FYI - the ISC and ISL engines look nearly identical and share some common parts. One big difference is the ISL switched to the common rail system in 2004.

Looking at Cummins documents it looks like both the ISC and the ISL changed to common rail in 2004. If this is correct I don’t know how your engine could be a 2008 CAPS engine. can you post a photo of the other side of the engine?
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Old 09-25-2022, 12:19 PM   #30
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Here is the data plate from Cummins, I assure you it is a caps engine. I will grab some pictures when I have a second. Also you are 100% correct, my trans has a pigtail with a round connector.

Now that you mentioned the years, I am wondering if the engine was older and rebuilt by Cummins, I think there is a remanufactured sticker from Cummins.
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Old 09-25-2022, 12:22 PM   #31
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Had some pics on my phone.
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Old 09-25-2022, 02:08 PM   #32
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Here is the data plate from Cummins, I assure you it is a caps engine. I will grab some pictures when I have a second. Also you are 100% correct, my trans has a pigtail with a round connector.

Now that you mentioned the years, I am wondering if the engine was older and rebuilt by Cummins, I think there is a remanufactured sticker from Cummins.
Yep that is a CAPS engine. I bet you are correct, that is a pre 2004 ISL that was rebuilt . If you can send me the engine serial number I may be able to look it up and tell you the exact year, CM number and etc; the configuration image you uploaded is hard to read.
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Old 09-25-2022, 02:19 PM   #33
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Quote:
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Had some pics on my phone.
Something for you to start thinking about.

That engine has a compressor on it. You need to determine if you are going to retain the compressor or delete it. My 6400 has the ACE rear air ride so I left the compressor and I use it for the rear air ride suspension now. Also the power steering pump bolts on to the back of the compressor so if you remove the compressor you will need to figure out if the power steering pump can bolt directly to the engine block in place of the compressor.

Let the fun begin.
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Old 09-25-2022, 05:17 PM   #34
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Yes I absolutely plan to leave the compressor, I plan to add air ride as well… just got a quote for the rear air ride…

ESN: 60316498

CM554
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Old 09-25-2022, 07:47 PM   #35
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Quote:
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Yes I absolutely plan to leave the compressor, I plan to add air ride as well… just got a quote for the rear air ride…

ESN: 60316498

CM554
If you don’t already have the information you can purchase the CM 554 pinout card on ebay. Just search for CM554 and something should pop up like the attached image.
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Old 09-26-2022, 12:01 PM   #36
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Quote:
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Yes I absolutely plan to leave the compressor, I plan to add air ride as well… just got a quote for the rear air ride…

ESN: 60316498

CM554
Cummins shows this as a 289 HP ISL CAPS Engine. Peak Torque is 900@ 1399 RPM. It was reconditioned by Cummins in Dec 2008.

It shows this engine has a 24 Volt fuel Solenoid. I am not sure if this means the entire engine is a 24 volt (ECM, starter motor) or?

I don’t know much about the older CAPS ISL engines. If possible my recommendation would be to return this engine and transmission and get a 2004 - 2006 400 HP common rail ISL and a 4th Gen Allison transmission. I am not saying your older CAPS ISl will not work, but it may take extra work.
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Old 10-02-2022, 04:07 PM   #37
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I took the Cummins 6400 out on the road again yesterday. No overheating this time but I am still getting a transmission code. Also the Wabco brakes started acting up again; I thought I had fixed that problem. At least I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

On this trip I confirmed the speedometer is working. I could not get a clear answer on how to hook it up so I took an educated guess. It appears my guess was a good one. The last thing I need to confirm is that the cruise control still works. It’s my understanding the cruise control is handled via the J1939 so I have my fingers crossed it will also work.

Once I figure out the transmission issue I will take it out for another short trip.
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Old 10-05-2022, 12:52 PM   #38
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Thats awesome Tim! I bet it feels good to drive it, even if there are small issues to iron out! Has your brake controller ever been replaced?
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Old 10-05-2022, 01:25 PM   #39
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Thats awesome Tim! I bet it feels good to drive it, even if there are small issues to iron out! Has your brake controller ever been replaced?
Yes, it does feel good to take it out and drive it after all that work. I can’t wait to go climb some hills and see what it does.

I think my transmission issue is a bad wire or wire crimp. Hopefully I have time to look at it this coming weekend.

To my knowledge the Wabco unit has never been replaced. I thought I had it fixed as it stopped throwing a code for a short time; I removed and cleaned all the + and - power connections as well as the power unit connectors. I also thought maybe it was a low voltage issue like you had so I charged everything up to max. But it apparently decided it was not done messing with me.
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Old 10-27-2022, 12:33 PM   #40
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I took the Supernova out for another drive this past weekend. I did a 30 mile loop and most of it was uneventful. I had no engine or transmission codes so that is a big win. The only issue I had is with the Wabco brakes. I think one issue I am having with the brakes is one or more of the brake calipers keeps getting stuck on. I am not sure if this is what’s causing the Wabco system to throw a code, but it seems to happen in conjunction with the code. I guess I need a couple new brake calipers to see if this fixes the problem.
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