Sumo springs on 2021 BT 5210 install and review

[Yukon Jack]

I just installed Sumo springs Maxum medium #47 blue on my 2021 BT 5210 Cruiser. I did it myself and wanted to let everyone know that it was worth it in my opinion. I had two complaints with the way the coach handled before. One was the wind blowing me around and two, the wandering back and forth on the road.
First I installed the Road Master Steering Stabilizer. That helped the wandering. Next I had the front end aligned. That helped the wandering some more. Then I installed the Sumo springs. That helped sop the wind from blowing me around down the freeway, and, it helped reduce sway which helped the wandering that was induced by sway. I think I am done for now as I don't think there would be much more improvement needed. I am satisfied. I was not a big fan of heavier sway bars and the shocks are new. I wanted to do the install without taking the tires off because I am lazy and always a fan of working smarter, not harder. I used two 10 ton bottle jacks, one on each side. You could probably do just one side but I felt it would need the sway bar to be un-attached to one side, and the coach would be quite tipped over to one side. I raised the side I was not doing at the moment just a few inches, and the side I was working on, to a height of where the tires were just about to leave the ground. Use jack stands! Now the only reason to want to remove the tires is there is one hole that needs to be drilled, and to do it right, the tires are in the way. I put the top bracket(no sumo attached) using just bolts into the three enlarged holes already in the frame. I used the bolts to hold the bracket into place and marked the 4th hole with a metal spring punch. I learned that the bracket should should be held up to make sure it does not sag down and cause the 4th hole to be drilled too low. This is where the third hand comes in or you could put one nut on the back of one of the bolts to hold it in place. IMPORTANT, when you are drilling or enlarging holes on the DRIVER side I found cables and brake lines running along the inside of the frame. the instructions caution you to check and you must. I pushed a screw driver into the existing holes and then went to the inside of the frame to bend the tubes and cables just slightly by hand to give enough clearance to drill. The method I used to avoid the tire removal was to start with a small drill,3/32, to drill the punched divot. I had a drill bit that was short and used a small drill motor and was able to almost drill in straight. After the drill was in I was able to jut the drill to go in all the way and then down straight. Using an angle drill motor would be best but I did not have one. After that I used successively 1/16th larger bits to enlarge the hole until I was at the 3/8ths required size. I also found the putting on the top bracket first was easier than trying to maneuver the entire assembly and align it to the holes. It is heavy. After the top bracket is on then put the spring with the bottom plate attached onto the top bracket. You can then lower the jack down a little at a time as you guide the bottom plate into place. Don't do this while you are under the coach. Lower it a bit then stop and go under the coach to move the bottom into place. You can align the bottom plate while you have all the parts on the bench. Put the top bracket, spring and bottom plate together. tighten the top bolts for the spring. As the assembly is laying on its side, use a square to align the two tangs on the bottom plate at a perfect right angle and then tighten the hex socket screw on the bottom plate. Un bolt the top bracket from the spring and then when you put the spring in place the bottom plate will be already in the correct alignment.
It's really not very difficult.
Questions?

[Yukon Jack]

An added benefit of the Sumo install is the rear of the coach is 1.25"taller. That also helps the wandering issue and tail dragging.

[Bogdan]

did you happen to take any pics ? id like to see this

[Yukon Jack]

I did not take any pictures as the pictures on the Super Springs website and instructions show it best. The finished work looks just like all the videos and instructions. Pretty straight forward. There was only one deviation. The bottom bar that holds the Sumo spring to the leaf spring has to be assembled with the U shape down due to the bottom leaf not extending enough to allow both sides of the bar to sit on it. So the U is upside down and the flat side of the bar sits nicely on the leaf spring. I can take a picture of this. I observed a few videos that showed the bar upside down from their instructions. The washers needed to have flat edges ground on opposite sides to allow the washer to sit down in the U part of the bar.

[Stovebolter]

Nice write up. Save yourself a little time and buy a 3/16-1/2 unibit.

[Yukon Jack]

Good idea. Thanks

[bbaluski]

when I went to the catalog I noticed this warning. NOTES: Do not use on van model; Requires 7" minimum clearance from sidewall of tire to frame (on dual rear wheel models) Does this mean you can not use on duel wheels?

[Yukon Jack]

It means not for B vans. Fits the Ford 350 and 450 duals. Plenty of room. Mine is a 350 dual.

[Larryjb]

Great write-up! I also have all the conditions you described, wandering and big trucks almost blowing me off of the road. ( I have a 2021 - 5210 )
I could not do all of the work and the price tag to have it done would be quite high.
Maybe I should start with a front end alignment. That could help a little for starters.
Is there a place or terminal under the hood where I could use a jumper wire and charge my Ford battery when plugged into shore power ?
My Roadtreks had a separator and all I needed to do was plug in the shore power and all three batteries were charged at the same time. I will try and post this question on a new thread.

[Yukon Jack]

The front end alignment helped a lot.
I have been thinking about how to keep one battery maintainer for coach and chassis. There is not a connection for house battery under the hood that is live all the time. Only the temp jump connection. I am going to hook the maintainer to the chassis battery amd run a small connection to the Zamp/solar connector on the driver side. It is connected directly to the house battery all the time.

[Larryjb]

I went outside and identified that exterior port leading to the battery.
That port is live all the time since it leads directly to the battery, strangely though,
the male connection is positive and the female connection is negative. To me, that seems to be incorrectly wired.
Anyway, what you are proposing is to run a jumper wire from that port directly to the Ford battery under the hood?
That should work as long as you disconnect that jumper wire before starting the engine. Therefore when you are plugged into shore power, the Ford battery will be charged along with the house battery?
Correct me if I am wrong or is there a better way to run the wire to connect the batteries?

[Yukon Jack]

You are right about the polarity. Zamp website says to protect people from accidentally shocking themselves when handing the solar panels the exposed male plug on the solar panel is the ground. I had planned to only connect the solar plug to the battery tender but as you pointed out the opposite is true. The on board charger can keep the chassis battery charged. I wonder which is better. Would using a tender take wear and tear of the larger coach charmer? What do you think?

[Larryjb]

I did some further checking on the wiring behind the solar receptical (sp) and I found the wires leading to the battery are #10 good for 30 amps. I do not know where I could buy the right plug in order to use the receptical to keep the Ford battery charged.
Probably I will look for a Battery Tender that I can mount under the hood, bring the plug out through the grille and connect it to shore power along with the regular power cord. Seems like double work when we already have a charging system in place, I just do not know how to wire from the Solar receptical to the chassis battery. Maybe I will look further for the Battery separator/ isolator under the hood that charges the house battery while driving. Sorry about the ramble, I just cannot figure out how to make it work.

[Yukon Jack]

I do not think there is a battery isolator under the hood. I see there is a 100amp breaker with a battery wire going to the chassis battery and then to the house battery through a plastic wire wrap. It goes straight across then down then out of the under hood area. I suspect it goes to the electrical box right beside the house battery box. I think that is where the connection is made for the engine to charge the house battery either through a solenoid or solid state isolator. I felt that if I were to run a wire to connect the chassis battery to the house battery and I used the outside route to the Zamp connector, I would definitely see this wire and be reminded to disconnect before going anywhere. As for the connector, I think it is a universal 2 prong connector. It is just Zamp has changed how they wire it up. I have such a connector with my battery tender I bought from harbor freight and I will check it. I am just on the fence about using an expensive house charger/converter vs an inexpensive 4 amp battery tender. If I am going to have to run a wire I might as well put in a battery tender. Looking for a reason to use one system or the other.

[Yukon Jack]

OK, just checked the universal two way plug that comes with the battery tender and it fits. Tight but it fits. Rember, you must cut the wires amd re-connect in reverse of you are going to use this plug.
Another question is, will two dissimilar batteries change off one battery tender and eventually switch to maintenance mode?

[Chuck v]

It is never a good idea to charge two dissimilar lead acid batteries in parallel...it my appear to work but one will not achieve a full charge in any reasonable time.


Here is a rather strong statement from a quality battery manufacturer, Optima.


We would strongly discourage anyone from connecting batteries in series or parallel applications, if the batteries are not identical in age, size and type. It sounds like your batteries are different in each of those ways. Different brands of batteries can have different charging and discharging characteristics, with some accepting a charge or delivering current faster than others. That can be true even if the batteries are the same size. Different types of batteries (flooded or AGM) also can have different charge/discharge characteristics. When you connect two or more batteries that don't charge and discharge at the same rate, one battery will probably end up overcharged and/or one battery will end up undercharged. Neither is a scenario you want to have happen to your batteries, as it will probably shorten the lifespan of both and could create a potentially create a dangerous situation, if one battery gets severely overcharged.
The same is also true of batteries that are identical in every way, except that one battery is older than the other. As batteries age (or get used), their charge/discharge profile changes. As such, they essentially charge and discharge at a different rate a year later, than they did when they were brand-new. That means you shouldn't connect batteries together that aren't the same age or haven't been used in the same application since they were new, even if they are the exact same make and model.
Unfortunately, that means when one battery in a bank of two or more batteries needs to be replaced, they should all be replaced at the same time. That doesn't mean the other functioning batteries should be discarded entirely, but they should not be used in an application that has batteries that differ in age, size or type. For some marine and RV applications that use a lot of batteries, it may make sense to isolate a larger bank of nine batteries into three smaller banks of three batteries, instead of connecting them all together. That way, if one battery goes bad, far fewer batteries need to be replaced.



Chuck

[Larryjb]

Well, it looks like Optima answered our question. I will go with a battery tender under the hood and just plug into shore power when at home. Additionally I wanted to add a second house battery however my BT 5210 was produced in March of this year. That means the battery is at least 6 months old and it would not be good to add a second battery. Also, I have a group 27 battery and the tray will not hold 2 Group 27 batteries. I will have to buy 2 group 24 batteries to fit. I will wait and see if the single battery will give me 24 hours of service using the refrig., lights and running the furnace overnight. Former RT had 2- 6 volt Trojans and worked well.
Next Mod. will have to be roller wheels on the hitch to stop bottoming out in driveways.

[dpitchai]

For the problems you described, I did the following:

1. Raised the rear by adding two leaf springs recommended by local Truck springs shop. Now the height from the fender to the ground is same for both front and rear. This solved many of the issues like front wheel jumping off the ground in rail tracks, heavy swaying in freeways, rough ride etc.

2. Added Bilstein heavy duty shocks in both front and rear as recommended here

3. Added Road master steering stabilizer as recommended here.

I am very happy with the outcome, the ride quality is comfortable. Not exactly like my Honda car, but definitely good. Swaying stopped. Due to rear raised, scraping my drive way also stopped.

During the labor day week end, I drove from central Indiana - Michigan - Wisconsin - Illinois - back to Central Indiana, sometimes at 80 mph. I absolutely loved the journey. I also had my extended family on the sofa and dinette through out the trip (9 passengers over all including 4 kids), they also felt very comfortable. My only concern is wind & associated noise coming through driver side frameless window. Hope this is a cosmetic fix.

[Yukon Jack]

Originally Posted by dpitchai

For the problems you described, I did the following:

1. Raised the rear by adding two leaf springs recommended by local Truck springs shop. Now the height from the fender to the ground is same for both front and rear. This solved many of the issues like front wheel jumping off the ground in rail tracks, heavy swaying in freeways, rough ride etc.

2. Added Bilstein heavy duty shocks in both front and rear as recommended here

3. Added Road master steering stabilizer as recommended here.

I am very happy with the outcome, the ride quality is comfortable. Not exactly like my Honda car, but definitely good. Swaying stopped. Due to rear raised, scraping my drive way also stopped.

During the labor day week end, I drove from central Indiana - Michigan - Wisconsin - Illinois - back to Central Indiana, sometimes at 80 mph. I absolutely loved the journey. I also had my extended family on the sofa and dinette through out the trip (9 passengers over all including 4 kids), they also felt very comfortable. My only concern is wind & associated noise coming through driver side frameless window. Hope this is a cosmetic fix.

What kind of springs did you install? Hellwig?
For the windows problem, I stuck on a sunroof air deflector. Works pretty good.

[dpitchai]

Originally Posted by Yukon Jack

What kind of springs did you install? Hellwig?
For the windows problem, I stuck on a sunroof air deflector. Works pretty good.

BT 5210 rear already has leaf springs. I added two more leaf spring to raise height.

This raised the height of rear over 2 inches, transferred some of the weight to front. This made RV to run more stable. I was initially doubtful whether the addition of leaf spring will do anything to ride quality but it did improve. The combination of all three upgrades did the trick.